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Glasgow Rangers

Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Kind of chairman I loathe, Charles Green. Forever loud mouthing to the media. Incapable of farting in bed without having to tell the world about it.

And it's all very well him threatening to take Rangers to the Conference league in England but, even if they finished top by 20 points, they would have no guarantee of being allowed promotion. They would still be reliant on an invitation to join the Football League.

And even if they passed safely over that hurdle and then raced up the divisions, there is no guarantee that they would ever be allowed into the Premier League, because the PL would also have to extend an invitation. And that ain't gonna happen.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

I'm think promotion from the Conference to the Football League is automatic now, as long as a few criteria are met (stadium, fair and proper person test of owners). This was part of establishing a more complete football pyramid. The downside for Green is that means he can't apply to join the Conference and would have to apply to one of the feeder leagues at tier 8 or 9.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

jts1882 said:
I'm think promotion from the Conference to the Football League is automatic now, as long as a few criteria are met (stadium, fair and proper person test of owners). This was part of establishing a more complete football pyramid. The downside for Green is that means he can't apply to join the Conference and would have to apply to one of the feeder leagues at tier 8 or 9.
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Not sure it would be automatic for Rangers, though?
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

I am not a big fan of rules that were made centuries ago and I don't really care about Wales or Scotland's respective FAs.
But I do like big matches so I would welcome Rangers and Celtic in the EPL. The sooner the better IMO.
Quickest way would be for the Football League to invite Rangers into Division Three and have 2 extra games that one off season and have 3 relegated and back to normal the next.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

It's mostly just talk. If they were serious about moving to the English League they would have attempted to get it done when they formed the newco, instead of floundering about in the lower echelons of the Scottish leagues.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

onlyme said:
I am not a big fan of rules that were made centuries ago and I don't really care about Wales or Scotland's respective FAs.
But I do like big matches so I would welcome Rangers and Celtic in the EPL. The sooner the better IMO.
Quickest way would be for the Football League to invite Rangers into Division Three and have 2 extra games that one off season and have 3 relegated and back to normal the next.
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Which one is division three?

PL, CH, L1?

Or.. L1, L2, Conf?
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Spursalot said:
It's mostly just talk. If they were serious about moving to the English League they would have attempted to get it done when they formed the newco, instead of floundering about in the lower echelons of the Scottish leagues.
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Yes, just a fit of pique by Charles Green.

But the Old Firm are serious about wanting to abandon Scottish football. And, above all, they'd love to join the Premier League.

Thankfully, it has been made abundantly clear to them that they are not welcome. Premier League clubs will not vote in their favour. Rightly so.
 
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Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

onlyme said:
I am not a big fan of rules that were made centuries ago and I don't really care about Wales or Scotland's respective FAs.
But I do like big matches so I would welcome Rangers and Celtic in the EPL. The sooner the better IMO.
Quickest way would be for the Football League to invite Rangers into Division Three and have 2 extra games that one off season and have 3 relegated and back to normal the next.
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I'm not a fan of the Old Firm.

I'm not a fan of bigotry.

I'm not a fan of clubs that would suck the very life out of football in their country and then abandon it when it no longer nourished them.

There are plenty of big matches in the Premier League already. And the matches against the lesser teams can be equally entertaining, if not more so. More importantly, those lesser teams have earned the right to be where they are. Why should two of them be denied their place at the top by two vile, avaricious clubs that do not belong in English football? Why should remaining Premier League clubs potentially lose out on places in Europe or even trophies?

Thank goodness the Premier League chairmen understand what they could lose. They recently voted unanimously to reject a proposal which would, eventually, have allowed the Old Firm into the Premier League.

So I'm happy to say that, in this respect, you will rightly be disappointed.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

I dunno. The Old Firm are no more scummy than Chelsea or Arsenal. Cardiff more than likely will be a PL team next year. Millwall are still a possibility.

I think a few club chairmen are cutting their nose despite their face. Rangers and Celtic are massive clubs and for a team like say Wigan, having 4 games a season against the likes of these instead I'd say Reading and WBA would be much more lucrative.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Superted said:
I dunno. The Old Firm are no more scummy than Chelsea or Arsenal. Cardiff more than likely will be a PL team next year. Millwall are still a possibility.

I think a few club chairmen are cutting their nose despite their face. Rangers and Celtic are massive clubs and for a team like say Wigan, having 4 games a season against the likes of these instead I'd say Reading and WBA would be much more lucrative.
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We can't do anything about the scummy clubs that are already part of English football's pyramid. But we can prevent more scummy clubs from adding to the pile.

As to chairmen cutting off their noses to spite their faces, the added revenue generated by marginally bigger crowds at two home games per season (clubs derive no income from away games) would be utterly inconsequential by comparison to the loss of revenue to arise from losing Premier League status - the probability of which would increase significantly with the arrival of the Old Firm clubs. Likewise, at the other end of the table, the threat of failing to qualify for the Champions League or Europa League.

In fact, given that each finishing position in the Premier League table will be worth possibly in excess of £1 million more than the position below it over the coming years, even a mid table club could lose considerably more than it would gain from the Old Firm's inclusion in the Premier League.

Voting to allow the Old Firm into the Premier League? Turkeys voting for Christmas. Ain't gonna happen.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

How much you reckon the TV revenue would increase by having the Old Firm involved?
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Superted said:
How much you reckon the TV revenue would increase by having the Old Firm involved?
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Not much.

The Premier League is already a market leading product. What would Rangers and Celtic add by way of new customers for Sky (or whoever is bidding for PL broadcast rights)? Most football fans in Scotland and Ireland already have access to Premier League coverage. Those markets are already saturated.

Rest of the world? What Celtic and Rangers would add is but a mere drop in the ocean. The Premier League is the star.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Rangers and Celtic are massive world wide. I think you're underestimating the effect it would have.

If you consider the top tier clubs as being us, Mans C & U, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool, adding in Celtic and Rangers would add 26 extra blockbuster games per season.

That would result in so much more than just "not much" more TV revenue.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

As Jimmy says, the additional TV revenue from adding Celtic and Rangers is unlikely to be an important factor.

If the Old Firm did join they would likely add to the number of clubs with secure PL status. At the moment we have seven ever-present big city clubs who really should never get relegated: Arsenal-Spurs-Chelsea, Liverpool-Everton, United and Villa (who do seem to be doing their best to challenge this statement). City look to have joined that club and Saudi Sportswashing Machine and West Ham with decent management should do. That is half the division, leaving ten spaces for all the other clubs. Adding the Glasgow duo would reduce those spaces further.

So its really had to see where a majority vote in favour could come from, even if the big clubs saw a small revenue gain. Half the PL clubs and all those in the Championship would have something to lose.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Put it this way, if they had the chance to kick out Man U and Liverpool, would they?

Of course not, yet the effect would be just as per your argument. Would free up spots for the other clubs, Champs League spots would be up for grand, etc. but, the value of the Premier League would diminish.

The reason why the Premier League is such a big carrot is because of the big clubs. Adding two more big clubs would make it an even bigger carrot. A club like West Ham would be foolish to vote against it in my opinion.

Spurs on the other hand I would argue have more to lose.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Superted said:
Rangers and Celtic are massive world wide. I think you're underestimating the effect it would have.

If you consider the top tier clubs as being us, Mans C & U, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool, adding in Celtic and Rangers would add 26 extra blockbuster games per season.

That would result in so much more than just "not much" more TV revenue.
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Celtic and Rangers are indeed, by most standards, very big clubs. But, in the grand scheme of things, they are but a drop in the ocean. They have little presence in most of Asia, Africa or South America. They have some appeal in certain parts of the US. And they probably have a number of fans in Europe.

But for them to add great value to the Premier League broadcasting rights, they would have to bring a significant, new audience with them. And I don't believe that they could deliver on that. Other than their hardcore expat Irish and Scots fans (of which the numbers are limited), most of their followers around the world will most likely already support a Premier League club - perhaps more so than they do Celtic or Rangers. And, more importantly, they will most likely already watch live Premier League games on TV. So where is the added value?

Ultimately, the potential downside of the Old Firm's inclusion in the Premier League is far greater than the potential upside. The club chairmen recognise that. And that is why they unanimously voted against it. 20 out of 20 against. I can't imagine the circumstances under which sufficient chairmen could be persuaded to change their opinion in order to attain the required majority of 14 in favour.
 
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Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Superted said:
Put it this way, if they had the chance to kick out Man U and Liverpool, would they?

Of course not, yet the effect would be just as per your argument. Would free up spots for the other clubs, Champs League spots would be up for grand, etc. but, the value of the Premier League would diminish.

The reason why the Premier League is such a big carrot is because of the big clubs. Adding two more big clubs would make it an even bigger carrot. A club like West Ham would be foolish to vote against it in my opinion.

Spurs on the other hand I would argue have more to lose.
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You're absolutely right to say that Man Utd and Liverpool are integral to the Premier League's success. But that's also why the Premier League doesn't need to add Rangers and Celtic - big clubs, certainly, but dwarfed by the big Premier League clubs in terms of global following.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Superted said:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celtic_F.C._supporters

Read the bit on worldwide supporterbase. HUGE in Japan, Korea, US.

Anecdotally, in Aus, I'd say they're tthe equal of Man U and Liverpool and their support is more solid, with the other two having more of their share of fair weather fans.
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They were huge in Japan because of one player - who no longer plays for them. The vast majority of that support will have moved on. Spurs were huge in Egypt when we had Mido playing for us. Not so much now. It happens.

And, yes, Celtic do have a hardcore expat support, especially in north America. But even if it is as much as one million, as claimed, that's still a drop in the ocean in the context of the hundreds upon hundreds of millions of Premier League fans around the world. And would each and every one of those supposed one million Celtic fans in north America tune in to watch Celtic in the Premier League? Do none of them already follow a Premier League team and / or watch Premier League games? Highly unlikely in both cases.
 
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