Guglielmo Vicario

[Welshspur60]

Cheers, I didn't see any of that from tv.

As for the goal itself, Vicario is doing what is being asked of him. We play this pattern time and time again where the CM comes for it and plays the ball first time out wide. Gray chose to take a touch, and what happened happened. Didn't we concede a goal where Vic played a similar ball to Sarr or someone and we conceded from it?

If it was an issue then he would not be doing it anymore, but he is being told to play this way. So any complaints if not want to be directed at the player on the ball who fudges up, should be directed at the coaches for persisting with it.....

About time we stopped this suicidal playing out from the keeper. We just arent good enough to do it. Just hoof it long and bypass our brick midfield , and hopefully one of our brick forewards will get hold if it.. Its just depressing how bad we are . 11 internationals who cant pass to their own teamates.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

About time we stopped this suicidal playing out from the keeper. We just arent good enough to do it. Just hoof it long and bypass our brick midfield , and hopefully one of our brick forewards will get hold if it.. Its just depressing how bad we are . 11 internationals who cant pass to their own teamates.

The women’s team did it today’s and scored a great goal
But they also looked like they could pass the ball and move off it
They actually look like a well coached side

 

[Welshspur60]

The women’s team did it today’s and scored a great goal
But they also looked like they could pass the ball and move off it
They actually look like a well coached side

3 0 up with 15 to go , ended up 3 3. Yes they scored 3 very good goals.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

3 0 up with 15 to go , ended up 3 3. Yes they scored 3 very good goals.

Yeah
They were up against a much better resourced side
And United hit the woodwork 4 times
But this spurs ladies team have improved massively though great coaching. They haven’t added many players (and the ones they have are being used)
The key though is a new manager can coach a team how to play in any form of football

 

[Mikey10]

Anyway - this habit of Vic's is getting more attention, which I hope at least gets him to consider cutting it out. It isn't healthy, for him or for the team.

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Great to see him calling out the arm waving and attempted blame-spreading too.

 

[thfcsteff]

The mistake was Grays, he called for the ball and had ample time/space to play the one time pass to Romero - maybe Vicario should have seen the player behind but as I said even with the situation being what it was Gray had the time to make the pass without the Forest player being a concern.

Romero's pass to Sarr v PSG on the other hand was much worse as the opposition player was in a much more threatening position wrt closing down our player.

Disagree.
Gray has come some 30 yards from upfield and is trying to take responsibility. As the experienced pro (and with the vision) he should know Gray is not a smart option there; Gray passes by the player who presses him but is in another 'game phase'. Had be been receiving deep he'd have checked. Gray certainly made a mistake in not playing it first time, but Vic had two or three other options; one could even have been saying 'man on' to make sure Gray knew.
Vic sees it all there. He has the experience. Play safe.

 

[thfcsteff]

He shouldn't have passed the ball to him considering the risk yes but Gray specifically asked for the ball, young or not he started this match that makes him capable. He asked for the ball, further capability he just had poor spatial awareness and thought he had more time on the ball then he did. The fault is primary his with a massive helping from Vicario. Gray's age is no excuse.

Vicario should not have passed to him there. Simple. If he doesn't then the subsequent mistake has no chance of happening. I have explained the 'spatial awareness' reason earlier. Again Vic has the experience.

 

[thfcsteff]

He's a kid yes but he doesn't improve by having his mistakes excused - he needs to learn from it. His awareness of where the opposition were and then his actions once recieving the ball were all poor - it happens.

You want to suck the opposition out of position, that is one of the main reasons you play out from the back and if GKs were not to play to defenders in these situations then it defeats the purpose.

He won't excuse himself and yes it was a mistake, but equally, we won't improve as a club if we can't see why that mistake is allowed to happen and Vic wears a good deal of blame. Your point about playing to defenders is right; in fact, Gray dropping in at that speed was bringing someone with him, so if Vic knocks that ball either left or right, then we have a great chance to progress faster.

 

[SteveAWOL]

Vicario should not have passed to him there. Simple. If he doesn't then the subsequent mistake has no chance of happening. I have explained the 'spatial awareness' reason earlier. Again Vic has the experience.

A pity that Kinsky is so inexperienced and not yet ready to compete for the position as our PL starter, as Vicario’s lack of ability with the ball at his feet really is a glaring weakness in this age of passing out from the back and when we keep conceding these sort of goals against teams which are good at pressing it somewhat negates the upside of his superior shot stopping.

 

[harr1984]

Vicario should not have passed to him there. Simple. If he doesn't then the subsequent mistake has no chance of happening. I have explained the 'spatial awareness' reason earlier. Again Vic has the experience.

Can't agree. We've played this passing pattern a hundred times before this season, it's clearly something the coaching team like doing and it's been fine - and there is constantly an opposition player closely in attendance but the player has played the ball out wide first time, or had a better touch/dealt with it better and there's been no big deal made of it.

It's something Vicario and the team are being asked to do and it's not his fault on the handful of times over a season it will go wrong unless the pass was really poor, which it wasn't....

 

[Mrs Vert]

I dont like Vic shouting at everyone. When he hardly covers himself in glory. Has glaring weaknesses. Need to make peace that we will continue to gift goals.
The entire team.

 

[glasgowspur]

He won't excuse himself and yes it was a mistake, but equally, we won't improve as a club if we can't see why that mistake is allowed to happen and Vic wears a good deal of blame. Your point about playing to defenders is right; in fact, Gray dropping in at that speed was bringing someone with him, so if Vic knocks that ball either left or right, then we have a great chance to progress faster.

This is the bit that I think has been missed, gray has done his job, he's dragged someone out of position giving not just Vic options but whoever Vic passes to.
Their press has been at least partially busted, gray was never, ever the pass there.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Anyway - this habit of Vic's is getting more attention, which I hope at least gets him to consider cutting it out. It isn't healthy, for him or for the team.

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I’ve noticed him gonading other players for a while. As for the first goal, yes Gray’s control should have been better but why didn’t he just pass it to VDV who was in a better position?

 

[Spur of the moment]

About time we stopped this suicidal playing out from the keeper. We just arent good enough to do it. Just hoof it long and bypass our brick midfield , and hopefully one of our brick forewards will get hold if it.. Its just depressing how bad we are . 11 internationals who cant pass to their own teamates.

We certainly need to adjust our tactics according to the team we're playing. All game Dyche, predictably enough, had his team thundering up like demented attack dogs to the player about to receive the ball so they could physically bully them off it before they knew what'd hit 'em.

Both Gray and Vicario should have been super alive to that threat but so too the manager. We don't know what Frank's orders were pre-match but they surely would have included instructing our keeper to put his foot through it at the merest hint of danger?

 

[Bedfordspurs]

We certainly need to adjust our tactics according to the team we're playing. All game Dyche, predictably enough, had his team thundering up like demented attack dogs to the player about to receive the ball so they could physically bully them off it before they knew what'd hit 'em.

Both Gray and Vicario should have been super alive to that threat but so too the manager. We don't know what Frank's orders were pre-match but they surely would have included instructing our keeper to put his foot through it at the merest hint of danger?

All teams play this way
It’s also how we have scored goals too don’t forget (chasing the passing out and also by passing out)
It was executed poorly by both players
What did burn me seeing it on Ben highlights was the reaction of the leaders … well so called leaders in Micky and Citi. They didn’t move at all after Gary lost it and I appreciate it looks like a lost cause but vicario actually look like he saved the first shot
None of the team look motivated

 

[harr1984]

We certainly need to adjust our tactics according to the team we're playing. All game Dyche, predictably enough, had his team thundering up like demented attack dogs to the player about to receive the ball so they could physically bully them off it before they knew what'd hit 'em.

Both Gray and Vicario should have been super alive to that threat but so too the manager. We don't know what Frank's orders were pre-match but they surely would have included instructing our keeper to put his foot through it at the merest hint of danger?

I would say that considering we play this way most of the time and who the opposition was it was the right way to go? If we just get our keeper to just lump it up to Richi against Murillo it's constantly coming back at you.

Its a risk and reward thing, it obviously looks bad and gets talked about more when we concede from it but we've also scored from playing this way and I don't recall all these question marks when it comes off. That being said Vicario isn't the best with his feet so it will be a risk of sorts, although having watched it back I don't have any issues with his pass on this occasion....

 

[Spur of the moment]

I would say that considering we play this way most of the time and who the opposition was it was the right way to go? If we just get our keeper to just lump it up to Richi against Murillo it's constantly coming back at you.

Its a risk and reward thing, it obviously looks bad and gets talked about more when we concede from it but we've also scored from playing this way and I don't recall all these question marks when it comes off. That being said Vicario isn't the best with his feet so it will be a risk of sorts, although having watched it back I don't have any issues with his pass on this occasion....

Sure, playing out from the back is a great tactic if your team is thoroughly drilled at it and less addicted to brainfarts than we are, but not when up against the kind of frenzied kamikaze pressing that Dyche's teams are notorious for.

True the alternative of bootong it upfield often means the ball often comes straight back but there's also a decent chance of launching a counter-attack. Certainly better than endlessly passing it across the back before returning it the the keeper for the whole process to start over again.

Especially as we seem more vulnerable against teams that employ an uber intensive high press against us. Dyche is no mug and would have cunningly set his team up to exploit our known defensive weaknesses at every opportunity.

That's not to say they were'nt the better team on the day, but it wasn't until we'd gifted them that ridiculous goal they really began to ping it about and put us to the sword.

We then wilted like snowflakes - like we so often do.

 

[parklane1]

Both players have to take part blame for what happened, seems to me that there are those who are attacking one player over the other. Both could and should have done better.

 

[Bishop]

Both players have to take part blame for what happened, seems to me that there are those who are attacking one player over the other. Both could and should have done better.

Some people are playing favourites because they want to deflect the blame off of a particular player. I don't even think it's something to overly focus on, it was a mistake it happens, it will happen again. As I said earlier if we want to play progressive passing football part of that includes passing from the back. It's a risky play style but it's one we want so there are downfalls to go with it.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Some people are playing favourites because they want to deflect the blame off of a particular player. I don't even think it's something to overly focus on, it was a mistake it happens, it will happen again. As I said earlier if we want to play progressive passing football part of that includes passing from the back. It's a risky play style but it's one we want so there are downfalls to go with it.

100%
We have scored from forcing these mistakes and concede from them too like all sides