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***OMT - Tottenham Hotspur v Borussia Dortmund - first leg***

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milo said:
Didn't we put out pretty much the same team tonight that we did in our last European away game?
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We did indeed. I'm talking about the group stage games, games where people argued it didn't matter that it didn't matter we were taking basically a full team out to Kazakhstan days before a game against Chelsea and that it was fine that Kane was starting because Poch knew the physical state of the players and we don't train wit them so therefore how can we possibly comment on their suitability to play?
 
StephenH said:
Trippier was all over the place tonight - and the midfield two were an accident waiting to happen.
But we have to give these players 'big game' time or they will never improve, it's hard to watch but invaluable learning experience.
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Agree, thought Trippier had a shocker. That said, he wasn't the only one but his errors seemed to stand out more for me
 
Robspur12 said:
Hard to say mate. I wrote a post after the West Ham game suggesting that we had to go for it in either the league or Europe as we could not win both. We have a tough run in, so the league is no more likely perhaps. Any way I hope we really go for it on Sunday and go out in a blaze of glory on Thursday other wise we are doing what I always criticise Arsenal for- being a side who have long ago given up on glory and settled for just taking part in the big tournaments.
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Bang on the money; maybe we have to just accept that we are not at Arsenal's level and are not in a position to criticise/critique them...
 
milo said:
It is true in that we played a similar strength side away against Fiorentina. No argument that we played a better side tonight.

The question is, was it worth playing a stronger side tonight if it would have had a detrimental impact on our league challenge and, even if we get past Dortmund, what is our chance of winning this Cup?

Even before tonight, we had a better chance of winning the league than the Europa League.
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To be completely honest Milo, If we'd beaten Dortmund over the two legs, I would have us as one of the two favourites to win the competition, maybe even the favourites. I haven't once actually thought that about us once since we've stared qualifying for this competition again. Of course its a cup competition and anything can happen etc etc.

We would have knocked out the best team in it.

To flip the questioning around....If we'd qualified for the CL this season and this tie was in the CL (or let's say we were playing Bayern or Barcelona in the CL at this stage this week), would Poch have put out the same team? Bearing in mind we are far less likely to win the CL than the Europa.
 
dawaxman said:
Surely it's just changing priorities

At the beginning of the season it was really important

At the turn of the year, a potential chance for champs league

After a run of 6 wins on the spin, not so important
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So as I said above, once we're in the CL next season (hopefully), do we do this then as well?

Sorry Dier and Kane, you're not starting at the Camp Nou, we're saving you for the league match this weekend? Especially galling when as Modric THFC has pointed out, we have tired them out potentially by playing them in so many games, some of which you could perhaps argue they were not needed in?
 
Robspur12 said:
Hard to say mate. I wrote a post after the West Ham game suggesting that we had to go for it in either the league or Europe as we could not win both. We have a tough run in, so the league is no more likely perhaps. Any way I hope we really go for it on Sunday and go out in a blaze of glory on Thursday other wise we are doing what I always criticise Arsenal for- being a side who have long ago given up on glory and settled for just taking part in the big tournaments.
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Spot on. What is so exciting about qualifying for something that you don't even come close to winning? we were in the CL once, it didn't exactly herald the beginning of domination for our club!

Life is short, and as a football fan the best memories are surely when you see your team win stuff? We had a real chance in this competition, yes Dortmund are a great side but we made it so much easier for them with that team! reckon we may still have lost but it would have been close with our full side out, and would have given us a chance to really take them on at the Lane.

Not only feel sorry for those that have spent however much on travelling to Germany, but also the fans that have booked tickets for the second leg next week!
 
Regarding the selection, I really don't believe Poch sandbagged it, my opinion is he put out the best team he could from players that were fit enough to play 90 minutes.

We know Dier and Kane have looked a bit leggy, we know Dembele is recovering from injury, that the FB's swap in, that Lamela isn't lasting.

We were on the end of an exceptional performance tonight, they coach the other guys too.
 
Oh, some Irish newspaper's suggested that the only reason Dembele, Lamela and Kane were thrown on as they were (1-0, 2-0 and 3-0) was because we would otherwise be fined by UEFA for deliberately fielding a weakened side.

Has this actually happened before? I know we were fined in the 90's (at some point) for fielding a weakened side in the Intertoto Cup, but that precedent seems difficult to enforce. It is of course jaw-dropping that such a situation is even being suggested with regard to a European away game against Borussia f*cking Dortmund...but hey, we brought it on ourselves. However, is there a possibility that we might be fined anyway?
 
DubaiSpur said:
Oh, some Irish newspaper's suggested that the only reason Dembele, Lamela and Kane were thrown on as they were (1-0, 2-0 and 3-0) was because we would otherwise be fined by UEFA for deliberately fielding a weakened side.

Has this actually happened before? I know we were fined in the 90's (at some point) for fielding a weakened side in the Intertoto Cup, but that precedent seems difficult to enforce. It is of course jaw-dropping that such a situation is even being suggested with regard to a European away game against Borussia f*cking Dortmund...but hey, we brought it on ourselves. However, is there a possibility that we might be fined anyway?
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I doubt it; after all we register a squad beforehand for the competition to use as we please...
 
Hootnow said:
To be completely honest Milo, If we'd beaten Dortmund over the two legs, I would have us as one of the two favourites to win the competition, maybe even the favourites. I haven't once actually thought that about us once since we've stared qualifying for this competition again. Of course its a cup competition and anything can happen etc etc.

We would have knocked out the best team in it.

To flip the questioning around....If we'd qualified for the CL this season and this tie was in the CL (or let's say we were playing Bayern or Barcelona in the CL at this stage this week), would Poch have put out the same team? Bearing in mind we are far less likely to win the CL than the Europa.
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I think that we are in the top three teams left in the competition with Dortmund and Sevilla. But cups are a lottery and I would be far more annoyed if we jeopardised a league challenge for a far less likely cup victory.

I would hope that we will be in a stronger position to fight on multiple fronts next season but my priority would again be on finishing in the top four. Unglamorous, I know, but it is in the club's best interests.
 
milo said:
We took it as seriously as the last round.

I am not saying that it is a straight choice between the two but would you have been happy to see us throw the league to stand a better chance of winning difficult tie?
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No I would have been happier to throw the game against fiorientina thereby taking another comp serious instead - we played a weakened side in the FA cup too
 
milo said:
I think that we are in the top three teams left in the competition with Dortmund and Sevilla. But cups are a lottery and I would be far more annoyed if we jeopardised a league challenge for a far less likely cup victory.

I would hope that we will be in a stronger position to fight on multiple fronts next season but my priority would again be on finishing in the top four. Unglamorous, I know, but it is in the club's best interests.
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Winning the Europa this season qualifies for the champs league and is far more glamorous.
 
glasgowspur said:
One was injured, Jan
One suspended, alli
One has a very good record against this team, son

We also have something like 6 games in 14 days starting from West Ham through to Bournemouth. Even if we don't win the league we need to keep something in the tank to stay 2nd
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I don't consider Jan to be first team at the moment

Get it with Alli

Don't get it with son... Not with Chadli too

We played with no centre forward away to one of the best sides in the world... When teams do that against us we main like hell as fans and call it negative

Make no mistake I don't see the Europa league as a priority due to the nature of the effect it has on league results but it makes no sense to sacrifice those league results and then play a weak team

It's like climbing a mountain and stopping near the top because your scared of heights
 
DubaiSpur said:
Yeah, that's what I thought. But then, why were we fined in the '90s? I'm a bit hazy on the details.
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In the 90s things were different: smaller squads, less games and easier to point the finger and say "that's a weak line-up".
Now there are squad registrations up front then there has been an acknowledge that squads can be used as you please - as long as you register beforehand...

I suspect the Irish newspaper is just speculating/stirring....
 
Bedfordspurs said:
I don't consider Jan to be first team at the moment

Get it with Alli

Don't get it with son... Not with Chadli too

We played with no centre forward away to one of the best sides in the world... When teams do that against us we main like hell as fans and call it negative

Make no mistake I don't see the Europa league as a priority due to the nature of the effect it has on league results but it makes no sense to sacrifice those league results and then play a weak team

It's like climbing a mountain and stopping near the top because your scared of heights
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Very good!:D
 
Gutter Boy said:
I think he is still being hampered by his foot condition. The original diagnosis was that it would take 10-12 months to fully clear up.

I expect to see much more of him next season. A Dier-esque progression
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Have to say I thought that too around Xmas, plantar facitis right?
 
I think I might speak for a lot of people when I say that a lot of the anger being shown is actually generated by the Europa league being a complete fudging waste of time if we're never going to field a full strength side in the knockout rounds. So why not just play all under 21s from the start, and save everyone the hassle of playing all those earlier games?

A question for Milo - do you see any net value in playing in the Europa League? What kind of team would you play throughout?
 
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