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Welcome Ange: To Dare is to Didgeridoo

Lilbaz said:
If it's quite obvious. You'd understand why buying 18 year olds was more important than buying ready made players.

You'd also remember the last few windows we did bring in ready made players.
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It’s quite obvious we are still lacking ready made players for the here and now, regardless of what transfer window you wish to go back in time with.

Yes there is a need to buy young players if they have potential. But it’s not what the team needs currently.
 
Gazza said:
It’s quite obvious we are still lacking ready made players for the here and now, regardless of what transfer window you wish to go back in time with.

Yes there is a need to buy young players if they have potential. But it’s not what the team needs currently.
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We have no club trained players. We had to address that otherwise in europe our squad is limited. Solanke, maddison, werner, johnson etc... brought in the last season. 3 of those homegrown as we also needed hg players. Buying ready made foreign players is pointless if we are unable to use them due to pl and uefa rules.

The space in the squad left by kane, skipp and winks could only be filled with clubtrained or 18 year olds.
 
Lilbaz said:
We have no club trained players. We had to address that otherwise in europe our squad is limited. Solanke, maddison, werner, johnson etc... brought in the last season. 3 of those homegrown as we also needed hg players. Buying ready made foreign players is pointless if we are unable to use them due to pl and uefa rules.

The space in the squad left by kane, skipp and winks could only be filled with clubtrained or 18 year olds.
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It’s been a fudging huge issue and will be for the next 18 months in reality
We do need more react made players but we also have the trade off of HG and club trained rightly as you say
We need more players that Ange will play though because he is flogging a dead horse with some
 
Lilbaz said:
We have no club trained players. We had to address that otherwise in europe our squad is limited. Solanke, maddison, werner, johnson etc... brought in the last season. 3 of those homegrown as we also needed hg players. Buying ready made foreign players is pointless if we are unable to use them due to pl and uefa rules.

The space in the squad left by kane, skipp and winks could only be filled with clubtrained or 18 year olds.
Click to expand...

I actually think we'll be OK. It would surprise me if we managed a top 4 space so realistically any UEFA football would be EL/ECL. Our squad is as big as we want it to be in that competition. This year we could have had Devine, Donley, Scarlett, Keeley, Abbott and Craig to really beef up that squad but we chose not to. We also lost Dorrington at the key time because of his injury recovery, whilst Phillips hadn't completed 2 years so we loaned him out. Next season, the only two on that list that we can't include in the EL B-list is Josh Keeley and Matthew Craig because they are 21 and become club trained. Then you have more youngsters like Lanks, Moore, Olusesi, Hardy and Williams-Barnett.

I think it depends whether a lot of these players get second year loans or start to become integrated into Ange's setup. Numerically, we can be so well stacked for a EL campaign. If we get in CL, I think that is a different proposition.

You are right in that we have no senior, experienced club trained players though. That can only be solved by buying back Winks, Cirkin, KWP, Edwards etc. I'm not a fan of that. I would rather continue as we are.
 
Muttley said:
I actually think we'll be OK. It would surprise me if we managed a top 4 space so realistically any UEFA football would be EL/ECL. Our squad is as big as we want it to be in that competition. This year we could have had Devine, Donley, Scarlett, Keeley, Abbott and Craig to really beef up that squad but we chose not to. We also lost Dorrington at the key time because of his injury recovery, whilst Phillips hadn't completed 2 years so we loaned him out. Next season, the only two on that list that we can't include in the EL B-list is Josh Keeley and Matthew Craig because they are 21 and become club trained. Then you have more youngsters like Lanks, Moore, Olusesi, Hardy and Williams-Barnett.

I think it depends whether a lot of these players get second year loans or start to become integrated into Ange's setup. Numerically, we can be so well stacked for a EL campaign. If we get in CL, I think that is a different proposition.

You are right in that we have no senior, experienced club trained players though. That can only be solved by buying back Winks, Cirkin, KWP, Edwards etc. I'm not a fan of that. I would rather continue as we are.
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We also have to give the youngsters gametime to develop. Or they'll leave.

It's a balancing act.
 
tommysvr said:
I don’t either. But he’s at 51.52% at the moment (I don’t think that’s good enough either). 66 games, 34 wins, 10 draws and 22 losses. We still need more time to find out what sort of team he can make us.
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My view pre Man U was wait until after Xmas period.
Post Man U, I'm now in the Ange out camp, but my toes in the middle ground now - because I'm not seeing anything resembling change at important moments.
We have to be realistic - we are in precarious position in the league, and if we get drawn into a relegation fight, we don't have the fight.
The next few games has a huge impact on whether it's relegation fight or back to mid table as a platform for building.
The latter I'm not against giving more time - I still can't see how and where the change will come, but I'd expect Ange and the club to know.

Take out the that first six months of feel good and teams not knowing how to handle us - it's relegation form, for about a year. That's not a blip; that's things not working - it's the job of the manager to fix that.
Is the solution to keep doing more of the same? Some people think so. I don't - I think that's disrespectful to the opposition.
 
Lilbaz said:
We have no club trained players. We had to address that otherwise in europe our squad is limited. Solanke, maddison, werner, johnson etc... brought in the last season. 3 of those homegrown as we also needed hg players. Buying ready made foreign players is pointless if we are unable to use them due to pl and uefa rules.

The space in the squad left by kane, skipp and winks could only be filled with clubtrained or 18 year olds.
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Or perhaps trying to replace the mediocre players in the first team without having to rely on 18 year olds. Would give them time to bed in rather than throwing them in to the deep end
 
Lemonade Money said:
I don't know how you can be one or the other at the moment. Give him at least a couple of seasons (and four windows), and then see where we're at. This in one week, out the next, micro analysis is ridiculous and counterproductive.
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Im in and have been since the start because of the reasons you state. I think we need more as a squad which includes depth and depth of quality, then I will make judgements against the top 4 sides (which is ultimately what these judgements come down to).
 
monkeybarry said:
My view pre Man U was wait until after Xmas period.
Post Man U, I'm now in the Ange out camp, but my toes in the middle ground now - because I'm not seeing anything resembling change at important moments.
We have to be realistic - we are in precarious position in the league, and if we get drawn into a relegation fight, we don't have the fight.
The next few games has a huge impact on whether it's relegation fight or back to mid table as a platform for building.
The latter I'm not against giving more time - I still can't see how and where the change will come, but I'd expect Ange and the club to know.

Take out the that first six months of feel good and teams not knowing how to handle us - it's relegation form, for about a year. That's not a blip; that's things not working - it's the job of the manager to fix that.
Is the solution to keep doing more of the same? Some people think so. I don't - I think that's disrespectful to the opposition.
Click to expand...
I'm not saying it's you coz I don't follow people's posts that closely and you're pretty sensible.

And I'll preface this by saying sometimes that we ascribe viewpoints to the entire fanbase when they are contradictory to make a point.

But when Jose, particularly, and Conte were here, I saw so many fans say, "why do we sit back when we get in front. We should go for the jugular when we're on top."

Now the analysis is all about managing the game rather than going for it.

The kid in me that started supporting Spurs loves how we play for better or worse. It's the 45 year old cynic in me that hates it and he's nothing but a clam anyway.
 
monkeybarry said:
My view pre Man U was wait until after Xmas period.
Post Man U, I'm now in the Ange out camp, but my toes in the middle ground now - because I'm not seeing anything resembling change at important moments.
We have to be realistic - we are in precarious position in the league, and if we get drawn into a relegation fight, we don't have the fight.
The next few games has a huge impact on whether it's relegation fight or back to mid table as a platform for building.
The latter I'm not against giving more time - I still can't see how and where the change will come, but I'd expect Ange and the club to know.

Take out the that first six months of feel good and teams not knowing how to handle us - it's relegation form, for about a year. That's not a blip; that's things not working - it's the job of the manager to fix that.
Is the solution to keep doing more of the same? Some people think so. I don't - I think that's disrespectful to the opposition.
Click to expand...
Assuming for a moment we loose today, Forest on Boxing Day won’t be easy. Obviously players coming back from injury may make a difference but I can see a scenario where Levy is making phone calls January 1st looking to make a change
 
DeanoAustin said:
I'm not saying it's you coz I don't follow people's posts that closely and you're pretty sensible.

And I'll preface this by saying sometimes that we ascribe viewpoints to the entire fanbase when they are contradictory to make a point.

But when Jose, particularly, and Conte were here, I saw so many fans say, "why do we sit back when we get in front. We should go for the jugular when we're on top."

Now the analysis is all about managing the game rather than going for it.

The kid in me that started supporting Spurs loves how we play for better or worse. It's the 45 year old cynic in me that hates it and he's nothing but a clam anyway.
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Ange got it spot on in his press conference the other day on the subject:

'It's a bit of human nature these days - We get something then we want something more and something more. Then that doesn't satisfy us so we want something else'

He's spot on :D...
 
Gazza said:
It’s quite obvious we are still lacking ready made players for the here and now, regardless of what transfer window you wish to go back in time with.

Yes there is a need to buy young players if they have potential. But it’s not what the team needs currently.
Click to expand...
I agree we could do with a couple of established players to balance out the many young players we have. But it's not that always that simple for a club like ours as Ange highlighted the other day. He said that they could have signed a more established player when the opportunity to sign Gray came up and he felt that it didn't sit right with him to pass up the opportunity of getting Gray for the sake of a player that will help us for a couple of seasons - would look back in years to come with regret at not signing Gray which I think is fair enough.

He did imply our next transfers (not sure if meant for this Jan window or the summer one) would be more focused on established rather than youth.....
 
Gazza said:
Or perhaps trying to replace the mediocre players in the first team without having to rely on 18 year olds. Would give them time to bed in rather than throwing them in to the deep end
Click to expand...

Who and who will buy them?

I know it seems simple in your head. But the world is a bit more complicated.
 
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