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Welcome Ange: To Dare is to Didgeridoo

spurspinter1 said:
There were a few that Conte had been clear about not playing as well, Jose too, that doesn't negate the fact that you still need another club to come in and pay the fee required otherwise you just end up with loan after loan or having to release players early a la Doherty or Aurier. Not sure who you are suggesting that Ange has exiled either, who hasn't he played? Dier came in against Chelsea, PEH has made a lot of appearances, not sure if I'm forgetting someone.

I just don't see it on the compensating for the loss of VDV, there's an argument that Bentancur and some workaround in midfield could work but that's not going to happen until February. But for Micky there are no players like him and he was already bailing out Romero. Re the forward line yeah I think there's enough cover there with a lot more to come from Johnson Veliz and hopefully Gill. Perisic is / was a nice option for sure but the reason our results have gone to brick is not having CB's suitable for the system and losing our current Eriksen ie the guy that knits everything together, it's not because we don't have the likes of Ivan / Solomon / Phillips / Sessegnon / Richarlison. Apologies if I'm being bullish on that point, but JM + VDV are the last two you wouldn't want to lose, with Bentancur coming in third but his absence will be more crucial in January.

There's no point making our that injured squad players were the reason for this slump in results, the self inflicted suspensions haven't helped but most onlookers knew the form wouldn't continue once we'd lost a few key players, anyone could see that come the close of the transfer window.

Whilst it may sound like I'm moaning, the key point is I'm happy with what Ange has done with what he's got, but unless we get him better the whole thing is a washout. Hoping for a full season of no bad fortune in injuries isn't really indicative of solid planning, and if we do get any kind of European football next season will be more testing so there's a lot of work to do on the squad (like there always is).
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Every side has that unreplaceable player, VDV is key because he can pretty much outrun anyone in the league and actually defend, some players you don't get depth for.

This is where I disagree, you can never plan for all injuries at the same time, as example we had very good cover for LW, Johnson, Perisic, Solomon and Richi have all been injured and we can still put out a decent player, CB's were always a gamble and it's hurt us.

The issue is the start we had has made people forget the task
- We effectively changed 7 first team players this year, plus added depth of Solomon, Veliz, Ashley
- So pretty much half of the usable senior squad is new to PL, new to club, or have less than a half a season of playing time for us
- New manager, vastly different playing style
- Loss of the best striker in the world

This was never a one window fix, and the fact that we are complaining about depth (not actual first 11 when fit) is an amazing testament to the work done.
 
Grays_1890 said:
I have seen enough from Ange to think that he will be a major success here if we back him, I think we will personally based on what we have started to do in recent windows Sunday was not the downer it would have been had he been in season 2 or 3, we knew that it was going to be a year of development and if anything knowing we could play like we did first half with an injury crisis for the ages was a massive indicator of what Ange is bringing to this side. We knew it was unlikely we would really kick on to glory in year one, the start was personally way beyond what I expected. We will be fine
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What would you term major success? I think even @glasgowspur is being very ambitious by saying 2 or 3 domestic trophies, a European trophy and consistent top 4 finishes.

For me, if we keep him for 5 years under this ownership model, I'd take consistent top 6 finishes with a few top 4 finishes and a domestic trophy or two as huge success. I know sometimes you can get a little run of trophies once you win one but we haven't won one in 15 years (and haven't won a big one in 32 years) so if Ange breaks that duck, he's done brilliantly. I'd also add the above must be achieved playing entertaining football but I think that's a given with Ange.
 
DeanoAustin said:
What would you term major success? I think even @glasgowspur is being very ambitious by saying 2 or 3 domestic trophies, a European trophy and consistent top 4 finishes.

For me, if we keep him for 5 years under this ownership model, I'd take consistent top 6 finishes with a few top 4 finishes and a domestic trophy or two as huge success. I know sometimes you can get a little run of trophies once you win one but we haven't won one in 15 years (and haven't won a big one in 32 years) so if Ange breaks that duck, he's done brilliantly. I'd also add the above must be achieved playing entertaining football but I think that's a given with Ange.
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For me, success for Ange is keeping me intrigued and invested, and by continuation, happy.

Love ebbs and flows, and at the moment it's flowing, long may it continue.
 
DeanoAustin said:
What would you term major success? I think even @glasgowspur is being very ambitious by saying 2 or 3 domestic trophies, a European trophy and consistent top 4 finishes.

For me, if we keep him for 5 years under this ownership model, I'd take consistent top 6 finishes with a few top 4 finishes and a domestic trophy or two as huge success. I know sometimes you can get a little run of trophies once you win one but we haven't won one in 15 years (and haven't won a big one in 32 years) so if Ange breaks that duck, he's done brilliantly. I'd also add the above must be achieved playing entertaining football but I think that's a given with Ange.
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I should have been clearer, I would consider that to be major success, but I fear others wouldn't.
A PL or CL title is all that will satisfy some.
 
glasgowspur said:
I should have been clearer, I would consider that to be major success, but I fear others wouldn't.
A PL or CL title is all that will satisfy some.
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Yeah, that's my fear a little bit. I think what you've outlined would be incredible success, it'd make Ange an absolute legend and it isn't impossible.

I honestly think if he was to achieve what I've stated, it'd be a job brilliantly done. Anything beyond either of our expectations would be mind boggling.
 
Can not disa gree with most of the views about success with Ange. But for me he has already shown that he knows what he is doing and from my own personal slant i like the way he has said he wants to play. Injurys happen to all teams ( some more then others) but we have really suffered as most of them ( so far) have been to our keys players.

IF we finish the season potless ( again) i will not be on his case ( or Levys) because he has brought back a smile on my face and i really am looking forward to the season and to see what progress we make under him.
 
Raziel said:
Every side has that unreplaceable player, VDV is key because he can pretty much outrun anyone in the league and actually defend, some players you don't get depth for.

This is where I disagree, you can never plan for all injuries at the same time, as example we had very good cover for LW, Johnson, Perisic, Solomon and Richi have all been injured and we can still put out a decent player, CB's were always a gamble and it's hurt us.

The issue is the start we had has made people forget the task
- We effectively changed 7 first team players this year, plus added depth of Solomon, Veliz, Ashley
- So pretty much half of the usable senior squad is new to PL, new to club, or have less than a half a season of playing time for us
- New manager, vastly different playing style
- Loss of the best striker in the world

This was never a one window fix, and the fact that we are complaining about depth (not actual first 11 when fit) is an amazing testament to the work done.
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I still think we're still alright at LW, especially as Son and Johnson can play there and I like Gill. It's not particularly relevant but I bet Richy has a tremendous record if you look at results he's been a part of, when he plays we win. CB was a gamble as you call it, I'd call it a dumpster fire.

You're right you can't plan for every injury but it would have been great if a suitable back up to VDV was considered a priority. As you say there won't be a like for like replacement but someone who would be vaguely suitable would be nice.

There was a huge transition in the last window as you indicate, but we coped with it without any question due to how quickly Ange was able to impart his style on the team, it's a credit to him. I don't really buy in to the idea of a bonafide 1st team as brick always happens during the season and changes have to be made unless you've just got one fixed style of play, which one could argue that both Ange and Conte do...It was predictable that we'd be moaning about depth by simply looking at the squad, which is why we have to put ourselves in a position to actually have a chance in the upcoming transfer windows, i don't see fans throwing toys out of the pram even if this hideous run continues - Results poor but the players have been giving it everything and putting in solid performances.

But the struggles currently aren't because of teething issues otherwise we wouldn't have started as well as we did. I'm obviously happy about the potential we've shown under Ange and the direction we're headed but as I've said brick needs to happen in terms of getting good enough back up so we can deal with injuries to key players. Patience is a virtue and all that but it is slightly bittersweet talking about writing off a season because of clear gaps in the squad because we've seen more than glimpses of how good we can be.

You didn't mention who Ange wasn't playing because they weren't fit for the system.
 
All about getting back in, and staying in, the CL.

I’d have said 3 it was a three season target, but with the start we have had…
 
Why is hardly anyone taking into consideration our injuries? Hearing all of these podcasts, radio shows, tv programs etc and they are all mentioning us being Spur sy and that the honey moon period is over yet we have our 2 first choice cb’s out, we had our whole midfield out injured / banned in the last game and now also have our saviour who has just come back from injury to help us in our time of need getting injured yet nothing mentioned? Hate to be that guy but if this was Liverpool or Arsenal they would all be making excuses for them.
 
Yiddo said:
Why is hardly anyone taking into consideration our injuries? Hearing all of these podcasts, radio shows, tv programs etc and they are all mentioning us being Spur sy and that the honey moon period is over yet we have our 2 first choice cb’s out, we had our whole midfield out injured / banned in the last game and now also have our saviour who has just come back from injury to help us in our time of need getting injured yet nothing mentioned? Hate to be that guy but if this was Liverpool or Arsenal they would all be making excuses for them.
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Because it's Tottenham
 
Yiddo said:
Why is hardly anyone taking into consideration our injuries? Hearing all of these podcasts, radio shows, tv programs etc and they are all mentioning us being Spur sy and that the honey moon period is over yet we have our 2 first choice cb’s out, we had our whole midfield out injured / banned in the last game and now also have our saviour who has just come back from injury to help us in our time of need getting injured yet nothing mentioned? Hate to be that guy but if this was Liverpool or Arsenal they would all be making excuses for them.
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Because we still put out teams that should have beaten Wolves and Villa, and would have done not for going all spu rsy again.

You are right about the other two clubs though.
 
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Yiddo said:
Why is hardly anyone taking into consideration our injuries? Hearing all of these podcasts, radio shows, tv programs etc and they are all mentioning us being Spur sy and that the honey moon period is over yet we have our 2 first choice cb’s out, we had our whole midfield out injured / banned in the last game and now also have our saviour who has just come back from injury to help us in our time of need getting injured yet nothing mentioned? Hate to be that guy but if this was Liverpool or Arsenal they would all be making excuses for them.
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Because Spurs fans are idiots and lap it up ...

Media is clickbait, and Spurs fans are the worse at falling for it, if City has Rodri & KDB injured, how can poor Pep cope with it? if Klopp has Salah injured, you need to understand (despite them having 19 other attackers), if we put out our fudging under 18's due to injuries, sexy ..

Same as everyone raging on the club now because the club has "let Ange down" with not having cover in every position ...
 
Raziel said:
Every side has that unreplaceable player, VDV is key because he can pretty much outrun anyone in the league and actually defend, some players you don't get depth for.

This is where I disagree, you can never plan for all injuries at the same time, as example we had very good cover for LW, Johnson, Perisic, Solomon and Richi have all been injured and we can still put out a decent player, CB's were always a gamble and it's hurt us.

The issue is the start we had has made people forget the task
- We effectively changed 7 first team players this year, plus added depth of Solomon, Veliz, Ashley
- So pretty much half of the usable senior squad is new to PL, new to club, or have less than a half a season of playing time for us
- New manager, vastly different playing style
- Loss of the best striker in the world

This was never a one window fix, and the fact that we are complaining about depth (not actual first 11 when fit) is an amazing testament to the work done.
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Fully agree. It was a gamble. And given our starting point in the summer transfer window along with losing Kane we were pretty much always going to end up gambling in one or two areas that we could avoid being unlucky with injuries and suspensions.

Will be interesting to see how we look with Romero back. Of course we'll still be without Maddison, VdV and Bentancur. But I think having Romero back will make a significant difference. In short that we can do without one of Romero and VdV, but ended up gambling that we wouldn't be without both.
 
Lilbaz said:
Put out a team that should have beat villa? Seem to remember in the summer many of our fans thinking we'd finish lower in the league than them. With a squad not blighted by injuries and suspensions.
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there was a lot of OTT doom and gloom in the summer

We were better than Villa even with the injuries (they were missing players too), we got the lead but failed to kill them off, or kill the game
 
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