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Danny Rose

Jurgen the German said:
He burnt a lot of bridges with some fans after his comments at the beginning of last season. I don't think he said a lot wrong tbh but can see why some people were irked but some of the things he said. The "Google" comment was very poor to be fair.
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That was the worst of it.

All of what he did was wrong, but publicly putting down your own teammates is a dingdong move.
 
It was an exhibition of gratuitous naivety! He thought he could use the media. They used him. He sat down with a Sun journalist and ran his mouth off. Said lots of things he thought was clever. They weren’t. The kind of nonsense people write on forums online or spout over a pint. The Journo must have been rubbing his hands together and went to town with the most juicy bits.

Anyone with any media experience would only grant such an open interview if they had editorial control and could sign off the article before it was published. It was horribly naïve and you wonder who advises or looks after Rose. He’s never been a diplomat. Just look at the way he plays. Direct, brash, act first think later, but also leading, pushing forward. He’s guns blazing. And when its channelled and controlled it makes him a real player. Now a little older he will become more controlled and respectable, he just needs regular games imo to excel.
 
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Apart from that Walker-esque brainfart, he did well. Perhaps not as adventurous as we're used to, but kind of in a good way. Think he was instructed not to be too offensive. Slowly getting there.
 
Jurgen the German said:
Disagree that he’s better than Rose ever was. Maybe he’s better right now, marginally but rose and Walker’s pace made us a more potent attacking force, they are/were also just the right amount of cynical and street wise. Rose was arguably the best LB in the league not too long ago. I don’t think the same could ever be said for Davies.
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Opinions and all that - but Im fairly comfortable with mine.

At his absolute best Rose was still a liability at the back, but the system covered him. And while people like to cite his attacking prowess - it doesnt actually stack up as any better than Davies.

Ive had this debate before, the best Rose vs Davies thing his fans can really come up with is that he is "Dynamic" (meaningless) and that he "gives the other team something to think about".

As if Davies doesnt.

Davies is a better defender, I dont think that can even be argued at this point.

And going forward - look at the numbers, they might surprise you.

I honestly think the real reason people think Rose is so dynamic and attacking etc is the difference in their styles. He is all action, a busy player, always looks like he is bolting everywhere full pace - where as Davies is understated, just positions well instead of charging around etc.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
Opinions and all that - but Im fairly comfortable with mine.

At his absolute best Rose was still a liability at the back, but the system covered him. And while people like to cite his attacking prowess - it doesnt actually stack up as any better than Davies.

Ive had this debate before, the best Rose vs Davies thing his fans can really come up with is that he is "Dynamic" (meaningless) and that he "gives the other team something to think about".

As if Davies doesnt.

Davies is a better defender, I dont think that can even be argued at this point.

And going forward - look at the numbers, they might surprise you.

I honestly think the real reason people think Rose is so dynamic and attacking etc is the difference in their styles. He is all action, a busy player, always looks like he is bolting everywhere full pace - where as Davies is understated, just positions well instead of charging around etc.
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Here's the data supporting it

http://www2.squawka.com/comparison-...created/goals_scored/successful_take_ons_%#90
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
Opinions and all that - but Im fairly comfortable with mine.

At his absolute best Rose was still a liability at the back, but the system covered him. And while people like to cite his attacking prowess - it doesnt actually stack up as any better than Davies.

Ive had this debate before, the best Rose vs Davies thing his fans can really come up with is that he is "Dynamic" (meaningless) and that he "gives the other team something to think about".

As if Davies doesnt.

Davies is a better defender, I dont think that can even be argued at this point.

And going forward - look at the numbers, they might surprise you.

I honestly think the real reason people think Rose is so dynamic and attacking etc is the difference in their styles. He is all action, a busy player, always looks like he is bolting everywhere full pace - where as Davies is understated, just positions well instead of charging around etc.
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Don't agree with that at all, at his best Rose was a very good defender. Hopefully he will get there again. People act like Davies (who is a very good defender) never makes a mistake or mis-judgment. He's already made them this season and he's also made them in high profile games, but people only seem to remember Rose for doing it.
 
milo said:
Here's the data supporting it

http://www2.squawka.com/comparison-...created/goals_scored/successful_take_ons_%#90
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Thanks - as I said, I suspect itll surprise a few.

the dza said:
Don't agree with that at all, at his best Rose was a very good defender. Hopefully he will get there again. People act like Davies (who is a very good defender) never makes a mistake or mis-judgment. He's already made them this season and he's also made them in high profile games, but people only seem to remember Rose for doing it.
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I dont think Davies is perfect, I just think he is better.

Rose had that Walker like quality of getting into trouble thanks to poor play/positioning, but then getting back and getting out of trouble because he is a good 1 on 1 defender. Yes, good result, but poor to get in that position in the first place.

Davies does this much less.

Its not my foggy memory, I remember Rose very well. In fact I could suggest its those who think he was the best there is that have a foggy memory. He never was, and if he was - it spoke more to the lack of LB talent than him being of a superior level.

Hes a good player. Good, not great. A good 1 on 1 defender, fit and tenacious, but he is not a proper top level footballer.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
Thanks - as I said, I suspect itll surprise a few.



I dont think Davies is perfect, I just think he is better.

Rose had that Walker like quality of getting into trouble thanks to poor play/positioning, but then getting back and getting out of trouble because he is a good 1 on 1 defender. Yes, good result, but poor to get in that position in the first place.

Davies does this much less.

Its not my foggy memory, I remember Rose very well. In fact I could suggest its those who think he was the best there is that have a foggy memory. He never was, and if he was - it spoke more to the lack of LB talent than him being of a superior level.

Hes a good player. Good, not great. A good 1 on 1 defender, fit and tenacious, but he is not a proper top level footballer.
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I think you are doing Rose a massive dis-service. At his best, he was the best left-back in the division -- there was a reason he was first choice over Davies. Fair play to Ben for taking his chance and becoming first choice, but it's nonsense to suggest Rose wasn't a top level footballer, he very much was. Whether he will get back to that level, I'm doubtful. But it will be good for the club if he does.

Why do you think Poch started Rose against Utd the other day?
 
Also this...

nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
Thanks - as I said, I suspect itll surprise a few.

Rose had that Walker like quality of getting into trouble thanks to poor play/positioning, but then getting back and getting out of trouble because he is a good 1 on 1 defender. Yes, good result, but poor to get in that position in the first place.
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Is/was one of the biggest myths around, especially regarding Walker. Walker took up positions that other players couldn't because of his pace and physical gifts. It wasn't poor positioning -- it's only poor positioning if you don't have pace. There isn't a better defensive right-back in the league than Walker at his best, he shuts his side of the pitch down (I think he was better for us than he is now).
 
the dza said:
I think you are doing Rose a massive dis-service. At his best, he was the best left-back in the division -- there was a reason he was first choice over Davies. Fair play to Ben for taking his chance and becoming first choice, but it's nonsense to suggest Rose wasn't a top level footballer, he very much was. Whether he will get back to that level, I'm doubtful. But it will be good for the club if he does.

Why do you think Poch started Rose against Utd the other day?
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I think Poch gave him a chance.

Poch made a declaration of a clean slate, and followed it up with Rose and Alderweireld playing. Pretty standard management.

I am, at no point, saying he isnt a good player. Im saying he isnt as good as many people like to assume.

For a supposed attacking fullback, I actually dont think he is very good in attack. Cant cross reliably at all, loses the ball a lot further ahead, doesnt actually provide much despite his huffing and puffing.

I think he is a decent defender, though positionally gets caught a lot. Pochs system covers this for him well (as it does others), helps him look better.

Its an honest assessment, not a witch hunt or anything like it.
 
the dza said:
Also this...

Is/was one of the biggest myths around, especially regarding Walker. Walker took up positions that other players couldn't because of his pace and physical gifts. It wasn't poor positioning -- it's only poor positioning if you don't have pace. There isn't a better defensive right-back in the league than Walker at his best, he shuts his side of the pitch down (I think he was better for us than he is now).
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Getting caught on your heels far up the pitch because you werent paying attention is poor positioning/play, regardless of your ability to recover.

Physically Walker is incredible, strength and pace. 1 on 1 he is quite brilliant, IMO, and it gets him out of trouble time and again. Much like Rose he is much less effective in attack than his reputation suggests. And despite his good attributes, concentration/intelligence are a constant issue for him often leaving him having to get himself/the team out of trouble thanks to his own bad play.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
Getting caught on your heels far up the pitch because you werent paying attention is poor positioning/play, regardless of your ability to recover.

Physically Walker is incredible, strength and pace. 1 on 1 he is quite brilliant, IMO, and it gets him out of trouble time and again. Much like Rose he is much less effective in attack than his reputation suggests. And despite his good attributes, concentration/intelligence are a constant issue for him often leaving him having to get himself/the team out of trouble thanks to his own bad play.
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I've always thought that Walker was much better in defence than going forward. Though at Emirates Marketing Project he has probably been more creative due to the way they play. When Walker and Rose were our wing-backs, I thought Rose was the better attacking player and Walker the better defensive one.
 
the dza said:
I've always thought that Walker was much better in defence than going forward. Though at Emirates Marketing Project he has probably been more creative due to the way they play. When Walker and Rose were our wing-backs, I thought Rose was the better attacking player and Walker the better defensive one.
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I tend to think of them as equally average. Walker used to play a lovely ball inside the right channel quite effectively, but otherwise his dribbling/crossing etc was just as unreliable as Roses.
 
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