Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

[Gutter Boy]

Honesty is not going to win votes.
General concensus at the moment is that the world is a brick show, everyone knows it, they know things need to change and will probably get worse before they get better, but the minute it affects them the toys get flung out of the pram.

Everything is there to transition immediately. Its only corporate greed and the big oil lobby that is preventing it.

Uruguay got there years ago, with no natural geogeaphical advantages (like Norway), simply by having the will

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

It's the same with everything,
Better NHS, yes, taxes need to up, Er no,
Independence yes, you'll be £1000 pa worse, fudge off,
Green energy yes, bills will go up, stuff that.

There's a reason we vote in private.

Problem is the government aren't honest about all these things. Really to get to net zero it probably needs people to only take 2 flights a year, move to EVs, heat pumps, solar panels, less meat etc but no government is going to deliver that message and the general population wouldn't accept it or be willing to pay for it. Also not to bring the EU debate into it but if we were still in it then freedom of movement isn't really compatible with net zero.

And therein lies the problem.

Honest conversations, being honest with and about yourself, a disconnect between what you say and what you do. Money being kryptonite to any greater good decision.

 

[P.D.]

Honesty is not going to win votes.
General concensus at the moment is that the world is a brick show, everyone knows it, they know things need to change and will probably get worse before they get better, but the minute it affects them the toys get flung out of the pram.

True, you'd hope with a big majority and another 4.5 years they might do something but guess all governments follow the same script.

 

[Kompakted]

I think the ranges will get better, insurance costs are still pretty high. Installation costs for home chargers will get lower, there will probably be a more common standard for chargers (USB C equivalent), more public chargers etc. It's definitely getting there and more advanced than heat pumps but I think we'll see much bigger advances in the next few years. I'd likely get a plug in hybrid now if I was going to change cars.

I suppose i am in the fortunate position of being given a company car so while I'm sure they factor insurance costs into my lease cost my current package isn't over my car allowance. I could have chosen a PHEV but the Benefit in kind tax is 8% whereas it's 3% for a full EV.

Sounds like the government are reviewing the tax incentives for EVs and also considering charging road tax for them (and ironically the proposal is to charge road tax on vehicle weight rather than emissions which will make EVs more expensive to tax), which won't help take up. They're in a hole with their fiscal rules though so scrabbling around to find ways to raise money while arguing they're not "increasing taxes on working people".

Labour logic is: "EVs are expensive so only rich people drive them, therefore they're ripe for a clobbering to make them even more elite"

On insurance costs I'm not sure they will come down as EVs accelerate faster (instant torque) and are heavier than ICE cars and so if you're hit by an EV you're far more likely to be killed or maimed - and the insurance company will be liable for the compensation. Is the logic.

 

[Gutter Boy]

I think the ranges will get better, insurance costs are still pretty high. Installation costs for home chargers will get lower, there will probably be a more common standard for chargers (USB C equivalent), more public chargers etc. It's definitely getting there and more advanced than heat pumps but I think we'll see much bigger advances in the next few years. I'd likely get a plug in hybrid now if I was going to change cars.

Solid state batteries are the game changer. You don't need new home/street infrastructure if they do 600 miles on a 10 minute charge. You just convert petrol station pumps to plugs.

 

[Gutter Boy]

I suppose i am in the fortunate position of being given a company car so while I'm sure they factor insurance costs into my lease cost my current package isn't over my car allowance. I could have chosen a PHEV but the Benefit in kind tax is 8% whereas it's 3% for a full EV.

Sounds like the government are reviewing the tax incentives for EVs and also considering charging road tax for them (and ironically the proposal is to charge road tax on vehicle weight rather than emissions which will make EVs more expensive to tax), which won't help take up. They're in a hole with their fiscal rules though so scrabbling around to find ways to raise money while arguing they're not "increasing taxes on working people".

Labour logic is: "EVs are expensive so only rich people drive them, therefore they're ripe for a clobbering to make them even more elite"

On insurance costs I'm not sure they will come down as EVs accelerate faster (instant torque) and are heavier than ICE cars and so if you're hit by an EV you're far more likely to be killed or maimed - and the insurance company will be liable for the compensation. Is the logic.

I'd try something a bit different/carrot-y - varied speed limits on motorways.

EVs limit is 80mph, petrol/hybrids is 70, diesels is 60.

 

[Kompakted]

I'd try something a bit different/carrot-y - varied speed limits on motorways.

EVs limit is 80mph, petrol/hybrids is 70, diesels is 60.

Diesels are most efficient on a motorway though. That's where they come into their own. It's when they're sat idling in traffic around town spewing particulates all over the place that there's a problem.

 

[glasgowspur]

Everything is there to transition immediately. Its only corporate greed and the big oil lobby that is preventing it.

Uruguay got there years ago, with no natural geogeaphical advantages (like Norway), simply by having the will

Problem I have with that is if you have a perfectly fine combi boiler that is as efficient as it can be or a Ice vehicle that is the same what is the benefit to me to replace it at considerable cost with only a small benefit.
And is that really beneficial to planet?
When either breaks down or become uneconomical to run or repair fair enough, but I see no point or benefit of it just because.

 

[Kompakted]

Really don't think we need an enquiry to tackle organised child sexual exploitation.

If I was ever in government one of the first things I'd do is organise a bonfire of things that burn public sector resources and money for often very little benefit and public enquiries would be 1st on the hit list. They've become the go-to thing for a government or local authority who want to kick a can down the road while placating public anger over an issue:

Public: "I'm angry, i want you to sort this issue out"
Government: "hey, wait, we'll have a public enquiry".
Public: "hmmm, what's one of those?"
Government: "It's where we appoint a judge to spend months or years inviting endless people to sit in front of them waffling on about how something wasn't their fault and then they'll issue a report that we will throw in the bin....will make good tele though. Think a publically funded Judge Rinder"
Public: "oooh, count me in!"

 

[Grays_1890]

Really don't think we need an enquiry to tackle organised child sexual exploitation.

If I was ever in government one of the first things I'd do is organise a bonfire of things that burn public sector resources and money for often very little benefit and public enquiries would be 1st on the hit list. They've become the go-to thing for a government or local authority who want to kick a can down the road while placating public anger over an issue:

Public: "I'm angry, i want you to sort this issue out"
Government: "hey, wait, we'll have a public enquiry".
Public: "hmmm, what's one of those?"
Government: "It's where we appoint a judge to spend months or years inviting endless people to sit in front of them waffling on about how something wasn't their fault and then they'll issue a report that we will throw in the bin....will make good tele though. Think a publically funded Judge Rinder"
Public: "oooh, count me in!"

Problem is people are falling for the old misinformation trick again.

There have been enquiries and people are serving life sentences for it, victims of Telford and Rochdale are condemning Musk for that exact reason and the fact they don't wanna be used as political pawns.

In principal I agree with your point, I think people deserve justice and where its not happened over a certain course of time I think people deserve the reasons why.

To caveat that given the news recently I have also done a dive into some of these crimes and the facts in many cases are alot different to what you would read and what people are believing on social media. On those that had sufficient evidence sentences are being served, in other cases there is a lack of evidence that met the threshold of enough evidence to prosecute or even identify and in some cases the threshold was not met, reviewed and then met and prosecutions were made (ironically it was under Starmer that happened)

Ultimately like anything this is about the victims and I wonder, well actually I know in most cases people don't genuinely care about them or the facts, its more about political posturing

If people really care about these incidence then they need to be against people like Robinson who nearly saw two trials collapse and have the opposite impact of what he was ironically campaigning about.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Diesels are most efficient on a motorway though. That's where they come into their own. It's when they're sat idling in traffic around town spewing particulates all over the place that there's a problem.

On CO2 diesels are fine, but the nitrous is horrendous. They are almost dead now (practically no new sales), so its just a little something to help consign them to history

 

[Gutter Boy]

Problem I have with that is if you have a perfectly fine combi boiler that is as efficient as it can be or a Ice vehicle that is the same what is the benefit to me to replace it at considerable cost with only a small benefit.
And is that really beneficial to planet?
When either breaks down or become uneconomical to run or repair fair enough, but I see no point or benefit of it just because.

You dont target the old ones, as you dont want to harm people. You just ban the sale of all new ones. So as they come to the end of their life over the next 5-10 year, you get the entire fleet replaced by clean energy. Banning all new gas boilers will force the industry to get itself into gear and move into the 21st century. Its the same with cars. Just ban new fossil fuels and let the old ones disappear organically

 

[glasgowspur]

You dont target the old ones, as you dont want to harm people. You just ban the sale of all new ones. So as they come to the end of their life over the next 5-10 year, you get the entire fleet replaced by clean energy. Banning all new gas boilers will force the industry to get itself into gear and move into the 21st century. Its the same with cars. Just ban new fossil fuels and let the old ones disappear organically

See that's sensible, end of life you move to newer and better technology, replacing perfectly good equipment for sake of it is not green.
Punishing people with taxes or tariffs is the wrong way to go about, IMHO anyway.

 

[Gutter Boy]

See that's sensible, end of life you move to newer and better technology, replacing perfectly good equipment for sake of it is not green.
Punishing people with taxes or tariffs is the wrong way to go about, IMHO anyway.

The problem is the government don't have the guts to take on the corporates.

The best thing we could do for our greenhouse gases at the moment (well second, after defunding fossil fuels through greening pensions), is let Chinese EVs in. But we're protecting the European, American and Japanese companies, who are a decade behind/still fiddling with petrol, but who hold huge lobbying sway.

 

[glasgowspur]

The problem is the government don't have the guts to take on the corporates.

The best thing we could do for our greenhouse gases at the moment (well second, after defunding fossil fuels through greening pensions), is let Chinese EVs in. But we're protecting the European, American and Japanese companies, who are a decade behind/still fiddling with petrol, but who hold huge lobbying sway.

I understand the reasoning but I huge doubts over anything Chinese.
In many cases the corporates are the governments, Joe Public just haven't worked it out yet.

 

[Gutter Boy]

I understand the reasoning but I huge doubts over anything Chinese.
In many cases the corporates are the governments, Joe Public just haven't worked it out yet.

You'd absolutely strip all the software out and rebuild that from scratch. But the basics underneath are worth it.

It's amazing, you go somewhere outside of Europe and the US, and all you see is Chinese EVs. Brazil, Indonesia, Thailand, Mexico etc. run on them now.

 

[P.D.]

Solid state batteries are the game changer. You don't need new home/street infrastructure if they do 600 miles on a 10 minute charge. You just convert petrol station pumps to plugs.

Just read up on them, sounds like they're likely 3/4 years away so I'd rather hold out until then. I suspect the nearer we are to them becoming available the more people will wait.

 

[P.D.]

I suppose i am in the fortunate position of being given a company car so while I'm sure they factor insurance costs into my lease cost my current package isn't over my car allowance. I could have chosen a PHEV but the Benefit in kind tax is 8% whereas it's 3% for a full EV.

Sounds like the government are reviewing the tax incentives for EVs and also considering charging road tax for them (and ironically the proposal is to charge road tax on vehicle weight rather than emissions which will make EVs more expensive to tax), which won't help take up. They're in a hole with their fiscal rules though so scrabbling around to find ways to raise money while arguing they're not "increasing taxes on working people".

Labour logic is: "EVs are expensive so only rich people drive them, therefore they're ripe for a clobbering to make them even more elite"

On insurance costs I'm not sure they will come down as EVs accelerate faster (instant torque) and are heavier than ICE cars and so if you're hit by an EV you're far more likely to be killed or maimed - and the insurance company will be liable for the compensation. Is the logic.

I read that insurance costs are high because people don't know how to repair them so they just write them off, probably a bit of that and weight. These new batteries may help with that. I don't know the mechanics of them but they should be simpler to maintain without so many moving parts.

 

[Gutter Boy]

I read that insurance costs are high because people don't know how to repair them so they just write them off, probably a bit of that and weight. These new batteries may help with that. I don't know the mechanics of them but they should be simpler to maintain without so many moving parts.

Yeah, they should im theory be simpler. Electric engines are a piece of tinkle, much less complex than petrol ones. The batteries are everything on them though. Sort that tech and we could have 100mph golf buggies.

 

[Batspur]

Problem is people are falling for the old misinformation trick again.

There have been enquiries and people are serving life sentences for it, victims of Telford and Rochdale are condemning Musk for that exact reason and the fact they don't wanna be used as political pawns.

In principal I agree with your point, I think people deserve justice and where its not happened over a certain course of time I think people deserve the reasons why.

To caveat that given the news recently I have also done a dive into some of these crimes and the facts in many cases are alot different to what you would read and what people are believing on social media. On those that had sufficient evidence sentences are being served, in other cases there is a lack of evidence that met the threshold of enough evidence to prosecute or even identify and in some cases the threshold was not met, reviewed and then met and prosecutions were made (ironically it was under Starmer that happened)

Ultimately like anything this is about the victims and I wonder, well actually I know in most cases people don't genuinely care about them or the facts, its more about political posturing

If people really care about these incidence then they need to be against people like Robinson who nearly saw two trials collapse and have the opposite impact of what he was ironically campaigning about.

Wow. That's some amazing mental gymnastics to put more blame on Robinson than the Pakistani scum that industrially raped thousands upon thousands of white girls that they despised because they weren't muslim.

Maybe you could share your deep dive with a couple of links? Or is your source trust me bro? Sounds like you would have been the people that refused to believe the girls for fear of being called racist. Protect the Pakistani scum first victims a long second.