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The London Taxpayers' Stadium Shambles

Jordinho said:
Posted on the Spurs Odyssey Forum by PrettyVacant:

Bit of inside info on the next phase of the Olympic Stadium debacle.

The Olympic Stadium may be going back into construction in 2018.

Basically, the stuff about the cost of turning the stadiumfrom foitball to athletics and back again that made the press is effectively all true. Ish.

The big cost is not simply the dismantling and rebuilding of the temporary stands (the lower tiers) every time. It's the (so I'm told) nine days it takes to do and the lost income that leads to. Note, that means for a one day event, the Olympic Stadium needs nearly three weeks between football matches. That means summer only.

Long term that means it is almost impossible tomake money from. Because it means only the summer spell can be used, and with the season starting in August and ending in May, that's a mere three month spell cut to just two months really (due to turnaround time of nearly 3 weeks) in which events are viable.

And that exact same period is the height of competition. Spurs will soon have the option of a major all-year events programme thanks to a retractable pitch making turnaround time one of hours not weeks Wembley. O2. Twickenham. Etc. They all can too due to relative infrequency of use. But the Olympic Stadium will find itself competing for events not only with those big venues, but with seasonal rivals too (the royal parks are now big venues for summer festivals, hence the value of other stadia being able to take events all year round.

Since events are the main means of the owners making money, and with some weekends in summer likely to include athletics meets (a contractual obligation) and thus diminishing revenue opportunitiestoo), the implications are huge.

So the owners are looking at a schedule, possibly one stand at a time, of reduced capacity, to install actual retractable seating (with all the mechanics that involves).

That is likely to cost tens of millions at best, and take years due to having to accomodate the sitting tenant (west ham).

It may also see big payments made to West Ham if the contracts specify availability of stands for matches. One stand removed per season hurts their capacity, and the changes to actual retractable seating are to ensure taxpayers get some of their money back, so some compensation to west ham who won't benefit at all seems likely.

And here's the thing. If it costs £50m to do, it could, once finished, make that back in just a few years. Because that would allow more profit making events and it might reduce change round costs by as much as £5mil a year too.
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Good money after bad is the expression that comes to mind.
 
milo said:
That's correct. The stadium is a temporary structure. I had a tour of the Olympic site before the Olympics as well.
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r-u-s-x01 said:
It was temporary by design, was meant to be mostly taken apart and reduced to 25k (?) athletics only venue.
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That's the funny and/or annoying part. The lower tier that was going to form the athletics venue was the permanent part of the Olympic Stadium, but to install the retractable/removable seating they have had to remove most of the permanent structure. I think the bits that are left behind the retractable seating in football mode are part of the original permanent structure.

So somehow the powers that be built a stadium with a small permanent centre and a larger temporary outer structure. In the refurbishment they have removed the permanent structure and kept the temporary structure. Moreover the only permanent part of the original stadium that remains doesn't have a view of the pitch in football mode, although arguably these are the best seats in the house for West Ham games.

It really is a complete fiasco. The thread title is a bit of a understatement, which is unusual around here.
 
trying to find the full terms - if it is going to cost 18M to move the seats from temp to perm what does it say in the contract with regards to them just leaving it in "non football mode" - does it explicitly state that they have to have it in football mode as they are only tennents for 20 days a yr (?)
 
r-u-s-x said:
trying to find the full terms - if it is going to cost 18M to move the seats from temp to perm what does it say in the contract with regards to them just leaving it in "non football mode" - does it explicitly state that they have to have it in football mode as they are only tennents for 20 days a yr (?)
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Yes, clause 10.1(a) of the Concession Agreement: "the Grantor must provide the Stadium in Football Mode for the Events taking place at the Stadium during the Football Season". Football Mode is defined to mean the front row of the lower tier being between 10 and 20 metres from the edge of the playing surface.
 
Out of interest any idea of fines /fees if they don't? if it is costing £18M to do each time, economically viable for them to just not bother? What are west ham going to do?
 
r-u-s-x said:
Out of interest any idea of fines /fees if they don't? if it is costing £18M to do each time, economically viable for them to just not bother? What are west ham going to do?
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I think it was just 8 million, not 18, but that number can't possibly be right. How many workers for how many weeks does that equate to?
 
Jordinho said:
I think it was just 8 million, not 18, but that number can't possibly be right. How many workers for how many weeks does that equate to?
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r-u-s-x01 said:
News articles seem to say 8 up and 8 down
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The cost of moving rows of seats from football mode to accommodate the running track, and back again, every summer has soared from an estimated £300,000 to an extraordinary £8m. That would have to be paid every year to fully move the seats back from the pitch, although if the lower tier of the east stand remains in place – a configuration that would still allow athletics to take place as at this year’s Anniversary Games – the likely bill drops to between £3m–4m. However, for next summer’s World Athletics Championships it is understood all the stands will have to be rolled all the way back.

The Guardian has learned the problem began when the stadium owner, faced with rising costs over the new roof and other factors, plumped for the cheapest option available when it came to retractable seating. However, it soon became clear it would take at least 15 days to remove the lower tiers, even with a team of labourers working 24 hours a day, and the same again to put them back.
Costs are so high partly because the seats have to be stored off-site in a specific configuration to enable them to be put back again, like a giant jigsaw puzzle. That will hit profits when staging non-sporting events like concerts – a major revenue generator for E20 and its operating company LS185.

If the process of reconfiguring the stadium takes more than a fortnight, that will leave less time to host concerts before athletics takes over for its mandated five or six weekends each year. Depeche Mode are among those due to play at the London Stadium next summer.
The original quote for moving the seats was given by Alto Seating, a company that went into liquidation in October 2015. A new tender document is based on the assumption that the total cost would be around £8m if all four stands were to be moved, although it is hoped that figure could be reduced over time.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2016/nov/02/west-ham-stadium-losses-retractable-seating-problems
 
Guns N' Roses will be playing there June 16. West Ham's last home game is May 13. That's a tight schedule to get all that retractable scaffolding out of the way.
 
Jordinho said:
Guns N' Roses will be playing there June 16. West Ham's last home game is May 13. That's a tight schedule to get all that retractable scaffolding out of the way.
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You really could not write it.

It could be a christmas special of 2012!!

I would watch it.
 
A second GNR date was just added. They'll probably make more money from that than they do from a full season of West Ham.
 
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