Marcus Edwards

[parklane1]

It's curious to me that if a player doesn't make it it's all down to them, but if they do it's all thanks to the manager. Maybe they don't have what it takes but we'll never know if they don't get the chance to play. Having said that though, when KWP comes in and is awarded man of the match in his only two PL starts and is still overlooked then it seems that even when they do everything right it's still not enough.

As i have said on here his attitude while he was at Norwich was awful ( and that was first hand from the guys who had to work with him), you do not have to believe that but that is what happened. I hope he learns a lesson from it and he buckles down and goes on to have a great future, but its down to him.

 

[Cochise]

It's curious to me that if a player doesn't make it it's all down to them, but if they do it's all thanks to the manager. Maybe they don't have what it takes but we'll never know if they don't get the chance to play. Having said that though, when KWP comes in and is awarded man of the match in his only two PL starts and is still overlooked then it seems that even when they do everything right it's still not enough.

I know it's off topic, but Aurier has been given a season to get it together. If he can't fix it up this time, then maybe KWP will gradually displace him.

 

[mjc23]

As i have said on here his attitude while he was at Norwich was awful ( and that was first hand from the guys who had to work with him), you do not have to believe that but that is what happened. I hope he learns a lesson from it and he buckles down and goes on to have a great future, but its down to him.

Thanks for the info Do you know to what extent his attitude was awful?

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

Whilst he's not blameless in what's happened, he's hardly the only one seeing a lack of progression. KWP and Onomah are two years older than he is and are token squad players at best, what's the motivation for Edwards if that's where it's going to get him? We've also had four highly thought of academy players leave the club this summer so clearly they are now seeing this as well. The system that Pochettino has put in place isn't helping these kids. Each year he cherry picks the best prospect from the academy and takes them out of playing games at any level, then people wonder why after a couple of years they haven't developed quite as hoped. Skipp is that latest to be added to the list, he's not a youth player anymore but he's not a senior player either, he's just a trainer. Onomah, CCV, Edwards, KWP and Oakley-Boothe have all gone through this same cycle and none of them are really any better for it. The previous generation of academy players like Kane, Townsend, Mason, Carroll, Pritchard, Caulker etc all went on loan from an early age, now loans aren't the perfect solution either and every case is different but it's surely preferable to spending the majority of their vital development years between the age of 17-21 playing barely any football?

Best post on this site in ages I agree with it all and it is something I have been thinking for a while myself. All is not right at Tottenham, starting to sour the current regime for me now. I guess managers are a bit like political parties you have to put up with the stuff you dont like for the stuff you do like. Feels a bit to me like we are losing our soul.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

I know it's off topic, but Aurier has been given a season to get it together. If he can't fix it up this time, then maybe KWP will gradually displace him.

Should sell him while his stock is relatively high not in a years time when like Sissoko he well be next to worthless and we are left paying big wages and we have someone in the reserves waiting to come through.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

It's curious to me that if a player doesn't make it it's all down to them, but if they do it's all thanks to the manager. Maybe they don't have what it takes but we'll never know if they don't get the chance to play. Having said that though, when KWP comes in and is awarded man of the match in his only two PL starts and is still overlooked then it seems that even when they do everything right it's still not enough.

I am actually starting to think he is a bit of a taco for signing a new contract, should have said he needed to see a clear path to first team football, which would be only one right back in front of him in the squad not two. Think he is going to fudge up a promising career. If I were a spurs youngster despite loving the club I would not sign to stay here.

Like Griffiths he should have left in the summer, we have a striker at the moment we would not even give a squad number to and another we only trust in cup matches against league one sides, but we are not prepared to give youngsters a go anymore.

As you said their lack of playing time in any meaningful matches mean they do not have proper game experience and effects their development.

 

[Maltese Falcon]

Should sell him while his stock is relatively high not in a years time when like Sissoko he well be next to worthless and we are left paying big wages and we have someone in the reserves waiting to come through.

If this was in Italy or Spain, he would be sold with an agreed buy back figure that can be triggered after two or three years. That way everyone benefits; the kid gets regular game time, the buying club gets a guaranteed life span out of its purchase plus a reasonable profit whereas the selling club is confident that if the youngster develops beyond expectations, they can retrieve their investments, albeit at a premium.

 

[parklane1]

Thanks for the info Do you know to what extent his attitude was awful?

From what i was told he came across with the Billy gonads attitude, he was also late on a couple of occasions despite being warned about it. That is from the coaches who were there at the time, they have no reason to lie about it.

As i say people can believe what they want, but the fact that this guy has not been given the time his talent maybe deserves shows that there IS a problem. Again i will say it is down to him now, IF he starts to behave like a young man and shows that he is willing to take the advice on board then he may yet have a future.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

Unfortunately Edwards has a large fan club of people who have never seen him play a game and form an opinion on what they read, I've seen him over 20 times and despite his outstanding talent and ability he does appear to lack team commitment to me. At age level football you can get away with a lot, the step up is massive and that more about your mental strength and I think thats his problem. There's a similar thing with Griffiths he looked good at age group football but you can never be sure it will be produced at the next level. We have a team with a great team ethic and even the unpopular players have bought into it, I cant see it being changed to accommodate a youngster.

 

[mjc23]

From what i was told he came across with the Billy gonads attitude, he was also late on a couple of occasions despite being warned about it. That is from the coaches who were there at the time, they have no reason to lie about it.

As i say people can believe what they want, but the fact that this guy has not been given the time his talent maybe deserves shows that there IS a problem. Again i will say it is down to him now, IF he starts to behave like a young man and shows that he is willing to take the advice on board then he may yet have a future.

Thanks for the insight. Hopefully the penny drops and it's not too late for him. He's obviously talented and has the ability to beat a man 1v1, but that won't just be enough to make it as a top Premier league player

 

[SpurMeUp]

Some good posts from @Yoof. It is a shame we couldn't trim the first team of some of the surplus squad players so there would be more genuine opptunity for youth players. N'Koudou did well for us in preseason, but more or less every time he came on last season he was dissapointing. Edwards coming on as a sub for 20 mintutes would have done more I think, especially against tiring defenses. Some might think the same of Sissoko and Winks/Skipp/Amos/Onomha and Aurier-KWP as Danish and Yoof outline.

We need to sell or loan the first team deadwood to make a little room for our home made talent.

 

[90291Spur]

Some good posts from @Yoof. It is a shame we couldn't trim the first team of some of the surplus squad players so there would be more genuine opptunity for youth players. N'Koudou did well for us in preseason, but more or less every time he came on last season he was dissapointing. Edwards coming on as a sub for 20 mintutes would have done more I think, especially against tiring defenses. Some might think the same of Sissoko and Winks/Skipp/Amos/Onomha and Aurier-KWP as Danish and Yoof outline.

We need to sell or loan the first team deadwood to make a little room for our home made talent.

Good job we didn’t buy anyone in the summer transfer window then.

 

[Gutter Boy]

On the first day when we spoke, John (McDermott) asked me what I needed. I told him, first of all the boys need to respect the team, work hard and be honest, good people. Then they have to be smart, fast, physically fit and have good technique and – this one is important – they should come here full of internal motivation and not expect their father or the coach to set the level of demand. The message is clear: if you’re responsible in your life, you’ll also be so on the pitch. If you acquire the right principles off the pitch, you’ll apply them in football. That’s how we can have faith in you. And they have to believe...in what we're bringing to the table

 

[Bullet]

Good stuff. I was thinking about Marcus Edwards this morning.

Someone like Adel Taraabt was thrown into the first team early to develop... PERHAPS he got complacent and thought "hey, I don't need to track back, I'm already in the first team, the crowd love it when I try a crazy skill, even if I lose the ball...why change"

Presumably El Pocho is circumventing all that by saying to Marcus "You won't get a sniff unless you change yourself". Fair enough

 

[braineclipse]

It's curious to me that if a player doesn't make it it's all down to them, but if they do it's all thanks to the manager. Maybe they don't have what it takes but we'll never know if they don't get the chance to play. Having said that though, when KWP comes in and is awarded man of the match in his only two PL starts and is still overlooked then it seems that even when they do everything right it's still not enough.

Under Pochettino Kane has stepped up from a young squad player (6 league starts, 3 goals) to a world class player. Winks has come from the academy to become an England international.

Kane had his real breakthrough season in 15/16, having turned 22 in 2015. Got his first league start under Sherwood at 21. Winks had his real breakthrough arguably during the 16/17 season, and continuing into the 17/18 season. Got his first league start at 20, but only had 3 league starts that season. Injuries have played a part though.

An academy player breaking into the team every other year on average sounds good to me. Especially when combined with the breakthrough of Dier and Alli to go with it.

KWP and Onomah both turned 21 in April. Essentially at the age both Kane and Winks broke through. I say we hold back judgement until we see what actually happens with them at this point in their careers. If the game time, possibilities and career trajectories that have been given to Kane, Winks, Dier and Alli doesn't motivate Edwards to do the one thing he should do - work his socks off every day in training and games to get better - that's not on Pochettino. His record at Spurs and Southampton speaks much louder than your claims that Onomah and KWP should have been given more game time at this point.

 

[braineclipse]

Best post on this site in ages I agree with it all and it is something I have been thinking for a while myself. All is not right at Tottenham, starting to sour the current regime for me now. I guess managers are a bit like political parties you have to put up with the stuff you dont like for the stuff you do like. Feels a bit to me like we are losing our soul.

If part of the soul of the club is developing academy players to first team players, when was the last time we could match the development of Kane (true superstar) and Winks (England international at least) within the span of three years? Carr and Campbell? 15-20 years ago?

One more player stepping up over the next two seasons would make it three players in five to six years. When was the last time we could match that?

 

[Bedfordspurs]

If part of the soul of the club is developing academy players to first team players, when was the last time we could match the development of Kane (true superstar) and Winks (England international at least) within the span of three years? Carr and Campbell? 15-20 years ago?

One more player stepping up over the next two seasons would make it three players in five to six years. When was the last time we could match that?

When was the last time any top side did that ?

It’s very rare and unusual as sides don’t have the capacity for failure or risk

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

If part of the soul of the club is developing academy players to first team players, when was the last time we could match the development of Kane (true superstar) and Winks (England international at least) within the span of three years? Carr and Campbell? 15-20 years ago?

One more player stepping up over the next two seasons would make it three players in five to six years. When was the last time we could match that?

It's even more difficult now for us as clubs like Chelsea and City will pay young players and their families so much money that the best youngster get hoovered up by them.

 

[braineclipse]

It's even more difficult now for us as clubs like Chelsea and City will pay young players and their families so much money that the best youngster get hoovered up by them.

I'm not sure how much of a problem that is for us. Not that we don't miss out on a few players that we would have wanted mind you, but there are a lot of talented footballers out there and spotting who will make it at an early age is a hit and miss game. We've been able to attract clearly talented players for our academy.

I've thought for some time that players "making it" too early with big money moves, (relatively) big wages with the ego and attention that follows can actually be a detriment to player development. Speculation from me, but I think we might get a positive self selection of players with the right kind of mentality in our academy.

We've seemingly just about completely turned away from the idea of spending significant money on teenagers just for potential, unless they're good enough for the first team. Preferring instead to focus on the players making it through our own academy. I think that's a good choice.

There's also the point of having some path to first team football. Jadon Sancho seemingly left City because of the lack of it. I think it's actually possible to have a too bloated youth squad with too many highly talented players. I think we're finding a good balance now.

If we can keep developing young players we'll strengthen exactly the kind of image we need to attract exactly the kind of youth players we want.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

I'm not sure how much of a problem that is for us. Not that we don't miss out on a few players that we would have wanted mind you, but there are a lot of talented footballers out there and spotting who will make it at an early age is a hit and miss game. We've been able to attract clearly talented players for our academy.

I've thought for some time that players "making it" too early with big money moves, (relatively) big wages with the ego and attention that follows can actually be a detriment to player development. Speculation from me, but I think we might get a positive self selection of players with the right kind of meteorology in our academy.

We've seemingly just about completely turned away from the idea of spending significant money on teenagers just for potential, unless they're good enough for the first team. Preferring instead to focus on the players making it through our own academy. I think that's a good choice.

There's also the point of having some path to first team football. Jadon Sancho seemingly left City because of the lack of it. I think it's actually possible to have a too bloated youth squad with too many highly talented players. I think we're finding a good balance now.

If we can keep developing young players we'll strengthen exactly the kind of image we need to attract exactly the kind of youth players we want.

It all depend on the families financial standing, kid at my grandkids school is with Chelsea and his mum, a single parent is more concerned with the money he might make than development and who can blame her.