Ange in or out?

[Benny_Lad]

Love him but not sure this is the right time TBH

I always said the right time would be once all of the old guard were gone. If he can make the big (correct) decision on Son then he has a clean slate to work with barring Ben Davies.

 

[glasgowspur]

I always said the right time would be once all of the old guard were gone. If he can make the big (correct) decision on Son then he has a clean slate to work with barring Ben Davies.

And mason.

 

[Bishop]

Err, no plan B. And he failed. With the best strike partnership in world football at the time. He. Failed. He officially broke Dele, and treated Rose like a c unt. He 'nearly' won me over partially by getting Ndombele on semi-track, but then he 'Jose'd' gave up and snided the bloke. Honestly, he got away with so much here...

Revision, Dele was already broken. His spell under Jose just confirmed it.

 

[Mr Gogolak]

Thats fair, I have supported him but come to accept it´s not going to work a while ago. I do think there are two reasons why he´s not gone yet - the main one being our results in Europe have been decent ( we was only two points off top spot in the league if I recall) and are still in it and don´t want to sack him after what happened with Jose. The other one being the candidates they want won´t be available until the summer, and would rather Ange over Mason managing European games (rightly or wrongly) but if/when we crash out of Europe I reckon Mason will be come in then.....

I believe another important aspect is how damaged our reputation was after sacking both Mourinho and Conte. We may think whatever we want about them, but their names still command - rightly or wrongly - a lot of respect in world football. There aren't that many people who'd be willing to bet on their ability to do better. From the (admittedly very limited) noises I heard, we were on the verge of being considered a managers' graveyard.

Whoever we get next will be under the impression that they won't get the boot as soon as they hit a rough patch and will be given the time they need to steer the ship. That's not necessarily true but perceptions are an important part of football.

 

[DubaiSpur]

Ange has a narrative for everything. He just picks a communication style that is more palatable to the public versus his predecessors like Jose. He's not blaming the culture but has his own list of go-to topics that he uses to deflect. He is rarely making himself accountable nowadays.

He's an excellent public speaker, honestly.

Trouble is, he seems much better at that than he does at managing. Postecoglou the politician would have been a star out there in Australia - in some alternate world he's running New South Wales or Tasmania or some province like that, dragging people along through sheer belief while deflecting all the unpleasant questions he can't answer. Or maybe a successful televangelist or something.

But Postecoglou the football manager, is having his gigantic flaws exposed in real time with no answers. And his deflections only work for so long. Eventually, some journo in that room is going to grow a spine and call him out on his fluff, asking something along the lines of 'do you think your haphazard approach to pressing, lack of controlling tactics, no cover for the defense causing players to chase back, is causing all these muscle injuries you complain so much about?'

He'll gurn and glare, but I think that's the point at which the last vestiges of bravado wear off and he's exposed for what he is - mediocre, and floundering in a job way, way, way above his level.

 

[billyiddo]

Revision, Dele was already broken. His spell under Jose just confirmed it.

Hard to argue against that having seen how he went in the seasons after but the first half of 18/19 season Dele was getting some really good reviews whilst playing in a deeper role (check his thread on here around that time) the whole team seemed to fall off a cliff the second half of that season - probably though a combination of Dembele/Wanyamas prolonged absence in the middle of the pitch, culmination of 3 windows without an incoming transfer and the majority of our starting XI having gone deep in the previous summers Euros (?) - things could have changed had we taken a different path to correcting our direction, but it's certainly not a certainly

 

[DubaiSpur]

I believe another important aspect is how damaged our reputation was after sacking both Mourinho and Conte. We may think whatever we want about them, but their names still command - rightly or wrongly - a lot of respect in world football. There aren't that many people who'd be willing to bet on their ability to do better. From the (admittedly very limited) noises I heard, we were on the verge of being considered a managers' graveyard.

Whoever we get next will be under the impression that they won't get the boot as soon as they hit a rough patch and will be given the time they need to steer the ship. That's not necessarily true but perceptions are an important part of football.

Exactly. Managers were turning us down left, right and center, and ultimately the only thing Deadweight Dan can offer his coaches is patience - he certainly can't offer them ambition.

We need Postecoglou to see out the season, imo - to prove to the rest of them that we're willing to give them time. Dump him the day after the season ends by all means, but he should get until then.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Exactly. Managers were turning us down left, right and center, and ultimately the only thing Deadweight Dan can offer his coaches is patience - he certainly can't offer them ambition.

We need Postecoglou to see out the season, imo - to prove to the rest of them that we're willing to give them time. Dump him the day after the season ends by all means, but he should get until then.

Or give Poch a 10 game bonus pre-season to evaluate and start fixing the squad, and possibly qualify for the CL

 

[DubaiSpur]

Or give Poch a 10 game bonus pre-season to evaluate and start fixing the squad, and possibly qualify for the CL

If he would come mate, I'd have him in tomorrow. He's the exception - even if everyone else turns us down, I think he'd still take the job just out of love for the club.

But...he's enjoying his time in the US, and that Sky interview made very clear he's focusing on their WC on home soil in 2026. This probably means another bloke between us and a Poch return.

And unless we want that other bloke to be an utterly mediocre chancer like Postecoglou, we need to give the current incumbent time, even if we all know he's done for.

Then we go into the summer in a positon to attract someone like Iraola, and then it's a no-lose situation from there - if he does well, we're laughing. If he doesn't, well, Poch will be available come summer '26.

 

[Surfless]

He's an excellent public speaker, honestly.

Trouble is, he seems much better at that than he does at managing. Postecoglou the politician would have been a star out there in Australia - in some alternate world he's running New South Wales or Tasmania or some province like that, dragging people along through sheer belief while deflecting all the unpleasant questions he can't answer. Or maybe a successful televangelist or something.

But Postecoglou the football manager, is having his gigantic flaws exposed in real time with no answers. And his deflections only work for so long. Eventually, some journo in that room is going to grow a spine and call him out on his fluff, asking something along the lines of 'do you think your haphazard approach to pressing, lack of controlling tactics, no cover for the defense causing players to chase back, is causing all these muscle injuries you complain so much about?'

He'll gurn and glare, but I think that's the point at which the last vestiges of bravado wear off and he's exposed for what he is - mediocre, and floundering in a job way, way, way above his level.

Has he been shown to be mediocre? Or has he managed the worst injury crisis the club has had in my lifetime, got us to a semi final of one cup, a quarter final of another and brought through several highly talented youngsters, and done all of that with largely a mindset of not blaming anyone else for it?

We're now in a position where some players have been out a long time and he's not just throwing them back in, which someone who is desperate for a result and to keep his job would do - he's easing them back to make sure we don't lose them again. With Romero and VDV on the pitch we've not conceded since they returned, so that's our two £80m defenders fit, as opposed to our 18 year old midfielder, 30 year old full back turned centre half, or our 22 year old Romanian newbie. Or Tiny Danso, who is a Dawson-esque lump.

Honestly we're like a perpetual engine on here at times, there's a movement in a direction and suddenly everyone jumps on the band wagon.

This season has been dreadful, but if you think the Conte, Mourinho, Nuno, Poch or anyone else would have coped better with the situation, you're dreaming.

 

[Legohamster]

at least the memes are funny

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

It's over 400M total, and even over 270M net spend

In, Solanke (65M), VDV (43M), Maddison (40M), Johnson (47M), Dragusin (27M), Gray (40M), Wilson (29M), Kinsky (16M), Bergvall (10M), Vic (18M) are just part of the list.

There are some accounting things as @billyiddo said but Ange has been given more money that any Spurs manager

p.s. (edit), this is why the "back the manager" flimflam and blaming the club needs some hard caveats based on last 3+ years

I think the figures for transfer spend have generally been reluctantly accepted....they've moved on to wage % now....please do keep up

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

The big issue is when they (as managers) failed, they both fudging deflected, resorted to narratives and did everything to blame the culture of the club well laughingly not taking an ounce of responsibility themselves (you cannot complain about culture/winning mentality when you have zero accountability yourself)

It wasn't a big issue. It's was a known issue. We knew this would be the likely outcome. And if they brought good times before that outcome...that's the trade off.

 

[glorygloryeze]

Hard to argue against that having seen how he went in the seasons after but the first half of 18/19 season Dele was getting some really good reviews whilst playing in a deeper role (check his thread on here around that time) the whole team seemed to fall off a cliff the second half of that season - probably though a combination of Dembele/Wanyamas prolonged absence in the middle of the pitch, culmination of 3 windows without an incoming transfer and the majority of our starting XI having gone deep in the previous summers Euros (?) - things could have changed had we taken a different path to correcting our direction, but it's certainly not a certainly

I think his downturn started when he was getting overplayed by England from after the 2018 world cup and then that Pickford-induced injury in that 6-2 win at Everton. Was never fully the same/fit for a sustained period after that imo

 

[glorygloryeze]

I believe another important aspect is how damaged our reputation was after sacking both Mourinho and Conte. We may think whatever we want about them, but their names still command - rightly or wrongly - a lot of respect in world football. There aren't that many people who'd be willing to bet on their ability to do better. From the (admittedly very limited) noises I heard, we were on the verge of being considered a managers' graveyard.

Whoever we get next will be under the impression that they won't get the boot as soon as they hit a rough patch and will be given the time they need to steer the ship. That's not necessarily true but perceptions are an important part of football.

Indeed, plus in football management circles (and football circles in general) they'll talk amongst each other about the realities of working at Spurs. Poch aside, those who work in the game in England and the bigger leagues will know much more now compared to, say, 10 years ago about how we operate.
I think that's why the 'football people' within the management structure has become more and more obscure, i.e. people who generally are less and less known about before they join, because we are having to cast nets much further afield than previously as the knowledge of how we are in reality is more known (and many more say "thanks but no thanks" when approached)